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Out of control prices
Repossession increases High interest rates Lower loan approvals Inflation eating up toy money Used bikes flooding the market All reasons why sales of motorcycles are dropping in the US and UK. Both Harley and Indian have decreased production by 25%. HD unit sales; 2024 151,229 2023 162,771 2022 178,451 2021 194,256 2020 180,248 Indian Units; 2024 25,000 approx. 2023 30,000 approx 2022 30,752 2021 36,634 2020 solid data not found Despite these grim numbers the global market is seeing record sales with Argentina up 50%+ because of rising disposable cash, fuel efficient transpo, easier in traffic and environmental purposes. Also growing options from five different motorcycle manufacturers is contributing to the growth. Some of these have had 92% growth in sales in recent years. That's huge. Makes me wonder why we don't see motorcycle sales increasing in the USA. Argentina only has 10 million more humans than we do. They have 43 bodies per sq. mile. We have 94 to the sq. mile so per land space we are twice as many people. What am I missing (I ask as I get ready to drive home in a 4 door truck on a partly cloudy 69 degree day)? In my defense I just got off the machine and was a little wobbly this morning. Yeah, that's it. That's my excuse. (LAZY!!!) . You meet some of the best folks behind bars. |
I always felt from the 1970’s that there were too many nerds riding motorcycles.
Hundreds of 49cc bikes on my area that don’t have to be registered so if they aren’t included with this so called sales data than it’s BS. Indian sales don’t look bad when one considers the effects of bidenflation insurance rape and high interest loans and increased local taxes . Same could be said for Harley . But killing the sportster had to negatively affect sales . Personally I don’t care . Most riders don’t have a real relationship with motorcycles . So they eventually go their own way to something else. Today’s bikes don’t require anything to ride. How many ever worked up a sweat kicking a reluctant bike to start? Or even change their oils? They are appliances. Look at E-bikes . Used bike market is down for sellers , up for buyers . lol. Low mile bikes , special interest machines, mildly modified stuff will sell eventually. Idk who buys all the HD barges built over the last 20 years? But motorcycling hardcore will always be here.
Inflation belongs in your tires.
Not in your grocery bill. |
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I agree with you on many of those points but I gotta say I'm glad nerds, or RUBS as some would say, got into the bike world. It forced Harley to make a better bike because these kind don't know how to work on their bikes and when it breaks down on a ride with all their buddies they wouldn't put up with being left behind because not a one of them would know what to do other than call a truck.
The only downfall to this benefit is HD prices went through the roof but a better bike in return. It's a good return. If all I was doing was putting around town an unreliable bike is not as critical but there are many times I'm 100-400 miles away from home in the middle of Nowheresville and if something were to go and it was something other than points, condenser, ignition weights, chain link, random bolt loose are MIA I'm kinda hosed. In saying that I think HD has gone too far. Right now they seem to be raising bike prices $1-2k per year. In 2019-2022 their profit per bike was $1,300-$1,500. In 2023 it jumped up to $3,700.00+ per unit. This year they brought chrome and real colors back, which never should have left, but many of the Softails and FLH's are $2-3k higher and they are sitting. I've seen new 2023 & 24 bikes sitting on the floor. Mainly the new water jug Sportster in the '23's. They can't seem to give those away. Those who wanted one have already bought one and now nobody wants one. I want to play with one but don't really have the time for one nor want to pay what they are going for. I'll wait for a used one. They should have reengineered the evo sporty to pass Euro regs. Heck, China done it. They just wanted to drop it because it wasn't a big money maker for them per sale but the new HD boss's are not thinking of the long term HD results those cheap Sportsters bring in. Almost all Sportster riders climb the ladder, eventually. Although I'm not much of a fan of the post 03 Sporty's anymore after owning a few of them. As soon as I get more space a 99-03 sporty will be back in the stables. I told you about that 03 883R that I came across MP that I missed out on. at $2k it went instantly. I would of pushed the Z125 outside if I could of nabbed that one. Some think HD has the 25's jacked up so high so that the 24's seem like a good deal and get them off the floor. I suspiciously think they are trying to boost profits to make the numbers look better to keep investors interested or maybe even a sale of the company altogether. They'd rather sell less than to make a smaller HD. A smaller HD wouldn't need 10 board members with the head guy pulling in $2 million per year salary + $16.5 million in ownership stock. The rest of the board has salaries at $250k-$300k + ownership funds between $65k-$700k. In total their salaries equal to over $23M per year plus any dividends or bonuses they don't have to post. In 2024 there was $91M in dividends paid out which means they are still profitable. You typically don't receive dividends when your not profitable. They sold 148,862 bikes in 2024 not to mention all the parts, accessories and clothing that are the big profits. But they could have dropped prices by at least a grand or so on each bike and not been hurt. Greed is going to eventually catch up and it will be the on the floor workers who will pay for it with pay cuts, rising insurance cost and layoffs. The kings will already have their gold. It's the floor guys I'm thinking of when I buy a new HD. I try not to think about the overpaid suits at the top. If I did I'd probably not step across the threshold of an HD shop/boutique. . You meet some of the best folks behind bars. |
Excellent post.
Question - Does HD engage in stock buybacks? i.e., using cash on hand to boost share price.
Bikes are horses, you don’t cry next to your horse that quit. That would embarrass the horse…
Choose to Ride.
Supports splitting everywhere.
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In reply to this post by Fatfatboy
Well…
It’s America and they can charge what they want. But I can decide not to pay it. I personally don’t think the recent bikes are any better than older ones. All the electronic shit is just too much for me. But I believe BMW and Indian are more responsible for HD upgrading their products. I rode to sturgis and back from Ct on a shovelhead.no problem. Had several evo and a couple of Milwaukee 8’s I think they were called. They were good. Fit and finish were always above the pack. The moco itself was usually the issue. Most dealers were lame. The new nightsters are ugly. It’s like they took plastic hospital urinal things , painted them black and strapped them to the lower front down tubes. That’s why the aren’t selling .
Inflation belongs in your tires.
Not in your grocery bill. |
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In reply to this post by oldironnow
Yeas they do. They Decided in July last year a plan to purchase $1billion by 2026 using cash flow. . You meet some of the best folks behind bars. |
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In reply to this post by hacksaw
I thought you owned twin cams. The Fatboy and a Super Glide? Did you have a post 2016? Bwahahaha!!!! Thats great. . You meet some of the best folks behind bars. |
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I thought you owned twin cams. The Fatboy and a Super Glide? Did you have a post 2016 that you didn’t share with us? lol. Thats great. . You meet some of the best folks behind bars. |
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