Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

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Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Allred
So new Harley CEO, Jochen Zeitz does a 180 and reverses Levatich's broad appeal plan, and instead is going to concentrate on the traditional client database with "what Harley does best".

https://www.cycleworld.com/story/motorcycle-news/harley-davidson-reveals-the-hardwire-plan/


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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Fatfatboy
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I have to agree with this plan over the previous. The previous plan looked appealing but to invest so much money and energy into segments that are always looking for the best tech at the lowest price just doesn’t seem profitable to a company that has to pay American wages, and museum support.  

Most people I know that like the idea of a non-cruiser bike from Harley typically won’t pay the asking price of a Harley.
There is a few that would but not enough to support the effort.

Another factor would be the dealership death. Dealerships would rather sell a $20k bike than a $10k bike any day so the support of low cost Harleys will not be there. Kinda like the Blast. Dealers hated that bike unless they had a rider program.
Now that Harley no longer has the street line up I wonder what the dealerships that have the rider programs are going to use? Chinese Harleys? (creak of door opening and imported Harleys stepping lightly into the room)


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You meet some of the best folks behind bars.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

oldironnow
Creeeeak....

I remember posting that Chinese HD question at CW 20 years ago (ish - long times agos),
and I remember Hack guaranteeing it would never happen.

("If you could buy an HD that was exactly the same in quality and in every other physical way, would you buy it?")

How can even a casual student of near and distant history not have seen this coming.

Granted Chinese HDs are not on the way, today, but they're grinding out so many parts for everyone, when does the CEO-mind not demand sum of the parts be shipped as whole for the sake of the bottomline and share price support?

The center cannot hold, unless it pays some kind of price.
Supports splitting everywhere.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Mad4TheCrest
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Fatfatboy
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Good points from both Mr. Iron and Mr. Mad.

On the Chinese thing. More and more parts are becoming foreign made on our beloved Harleys. Forks have always been but I've seen it in the wheels since I change my own tires.
Harley tries to hide the amount of foreign content. You wouldn't know your wheels are imported unless you change your own tires. It's printed on the inside. I've seen it change throughout the years on the mag wheels.

2003 Fatboy wheels made in USA. 2010 Dresser mags made in Austria. In 2011 (I think) the Austria maker was forced to shut because HD pulled the production and moved to China for their mag wheels.

One thing HD can bank on is the younger gens. will not have the same Made In America wants because they are more accustomed to imported goods. It's us old farts that still want to see the USA stamp for the most part.

I'm not trying to be political here but that was one good thing that Trump was doing. He was making it harder on imports. He was making it so that some companies were coming back to the good ol' USA because of the cost of importing.

This has caused some issues in my business. Many of the products that we use are made in China because all the American manufacturing is gone. Things like door hardware, aluminum u-channels, handrailing components etc. Many delays on jobs because of this.
It does cause me headaches and makes my company not look the greatest but if it were to change where we get our products I will gladly handle these delays now.
I just don't think there will be a huge swing of it coming back to USA. It won't be long everyone will get their vaccines and everything will get back in it's proper order and low cost desire will rule the day. Sad.


As for Mads point that HD management not conceiving the selling of just a few thousand bikes vs the 10K plus I believe this to be spot on.
As a person that does have to count the beans I can understand their business process. They can make more money selling the same thing over and over that they know sells versus having the varied product that, even though it is a good product, it may not sell as well or at a minimal profit. Think Vrod.

We all kinda have this same scenario in our lives. If I was working making gogwidgets at $15.00 per hour. Sweating in a 102 degree factory 10 hours a day and I had an option of making doodlewidgets at $18.75 per hour 8 hours a day in a 80 degree factory I would jump at the doodlewidgets job making same amount for less effort.
I think that is HD sees it. Why work to make a few bucks when they can make more by sticking with what they know. It's worked for 118 years.

 
   

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You meet some of the best folks behind bars.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

oldironnow
I like much of your analysis, Mr. ffb.

I do a lot of work with firms that import entire things and sub-assemblies for re-sale here and even abroad. It's a lot of shuffling stuff around and relabeling things and then moving said things along again. It all SCREAMS to be streamlined and drop-shipped whole straight out of all of Asia and India directly to the customer. I mean, that is the essential model of Amazon. That company actually hunts and kills American (and world-wide) entrepreneurs with this tactic.

The factories we have out here are in the fields where humans plant and grow food, so that's kind of a static situation. There were weird pressures in that area. Field-use expands and shrinks, but no one opened a new strawberry factory. In fact, an old strawberry consortium closed.

Garlic got 'healthier' over the hill in Gilroy, but that means we paid more for garlic at the counter. It's kind of the inverse resolution to what I proposed in that same thread so long ago - "We will build TVs again when we work for five dollars a day." Our wages aren't decreasing, but prices rise over time to cause the same effect. Huh.

I haven't heard of any factories re-opening in the States. Perhaps in The Middle, you have seen this. Automation is King here. Everywhere I turn, human work keeps losing to machine work. It's like Quint slowly being eaten on the busted deck of the Orca.

I get this feeling. Like the economy of the world is precarious giant pile of dry sticks. A mountainous shape, heaped to the sky, seemingly formidable and resolute. Yet upon walking up to it, the entire mound is riddled with gaps and cavities, compromises and air-spaces set-up and built upon over centuries, a structure of casual convenience in the moment. One can crawl inside and see opportunity for shortcuts - wormholes to wealth for the clever and nimble. And stepping back from the mountain one can see the entire pile of sticks can be easily crushed to the ground, or set afire from the bottom, like a Burning Man effigy to the entire flow of our lives.

I don't think your scenario of HD functioning as a worker able to move from one job to another is exact.

HD, as it is, the preeminent American manufacturer of heavyweight motorcycles, can only exist as such if it does as such. If it fails, it dies. It may be reborn as a manufacturer of something else (Cyclone went on to bend tubing to make hospital beds), but collapse is game over.

That board of directors wants to live their lives as "Harley Davidson - Kings of America," and they're in a shirts-off knife fight. If they try some fancy trick-move they read about in a book, they may loose an arm and bleed out.

With their stock share price looming over their shoulders, their fighting box is so small - An old-school product, driven by old-school customer desires, who have old-school income levels, while their competitors are free to meet any demand and any style with any tech from any location to satisfy any price.

The Board will do anything to stay alive. That's who they are fighting for. Themselves.

What they should have done is used MV Agusta, from day one of ownership 12 years-ago, to branch out into the new world of everything. It would've been the name-plate to hang on any product. Now the money-stream is low, and precarious in the near-term.

My 2009 Buell rims have a big blobby Made In China glimmering out of the translucent blue paint. I believe that Austrian factory that you mentioned cast the frame/tank.

I respect that I could well be completely off track here and in the gravel. Just thinking and typing.
Supports splitting everywhere.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Fatfatboy
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oldironnow wrote

What they should have done is used MV Agusta, from day one of ownership 12 years-ago, to branch out into the new world of everything. It would've been the name-plate to hang on any product. Now the money-stream is low, and precarious in the near-term.

My 2009 Buell rims have a big blobby Made In China glimmering out of the translucent blue paint. I believe that Austrian factory that you mentioned cast the frame/tank.
 Yes on the MV Agusta deal. Why Harley paid $109,000,000.00 including $70,000,000.00 of bad debt and then sold it back two years later for a whapping $3.98 I will never understand.
I wonder if they took a fiver and told them to keep the change.
This deal actually kinda pisses me off. I'm glad I'm not a share holder of a company that makes these types of deals.

I was wrong on where the wheels came from from. It was Australia. Not Austria.
Interesting that your 2008 wheels are made in China where as my 2010 wheels made in Australia. I guess it depends on the wheel.

In looking to get info on wheel production I found this from August 2020 that states Harley was buying the wheel manufacturer Castalloy in Australia and renaming it New Castalloy.

I wonder, because of inflation, if the previous owners will have to bring a twenty to buy it back in 2023?
I also wonder if I can convince HD to get into the glass business for a year or so?

https://www.reliableplant.com/Read/2472/harley-davidson-purchases-wheel-manufacturer

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You meet some of the best folks behind bars.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

oldironnow
Send them a proposal! Maybe you will hit it!

New Castalloy got re-established and ran a while longer:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-01-31/new-castalloy-to-close-with-120-jobs-lost/9377982
Supports splitting everywhere.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

Fatfatboy
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Weird,, the article I posted was posted August of 2020 saying Harley was purchasing Castalloy but the article you posted has the closing dates before.  
“You have entered the twilight zone. Beyond this world strange things are known....
Use the key unlock the door.
See what your fate might have in store.”

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You meet some of the best folks behind bars.
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Re: Zeitz reverses Levatich's Harley plan

oldironnow
Yes. Through the looking glass.

I staggered around a bit trying to get my bearings on the dates.. and then just let it go.
Supports splitting everywhere.